Prime Venture Partners Podcast

MakeMyTrip Acquisition, 2000+ cities in India, an incredible 'Savaari' with Gaurav Aggarwal, Founder & CEO at Savaari

• Prime Venture Partners: Early Stage VC Fund • Season 1 • Episode 139

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In this podcast episode, Amit Somani speaks to Gaurav Aggarwal the incredible Founder & CEO at Savaari Car Rentals who inspiringly led his company to be acquired by MakeMyTrip in 2023/2024.  

Savaari is India's largest premier chauffeur driven inter-city car rental service with presence in 2000+ Indian cities.

Gaurav is a resilient, poster boy of Indian Startup M&A success story. He has silently built a ~₹100 Crore ARR startup by just raising 2 rounds of funding in a crowded space amidst the storms of global competition (with billions of dollars). 

This strategic Merger & Acquisition (M&A) with MakeMyTrip is a trendsetter and exemplar for all founders in the Indian startup ecosystem and VCs alike. 

He signs off saying, Savaari Car Rentals will be a ~₹1000 Crore company in 5 years! 

Watch this episode to learn key snippets on building an enduring startup the right way in a very difficult unorganised, crowded market! 

Listen to the podcast to learn more about:

0:00 - From Cisco to Car Rental Startup

4:16 - Transitioning to Entrepreneurship in India

7:45 - Intercity Transportation Market Insights

19:01 - Navigating the Competitive Landscape

23:33 - Staying the Course

30:59 - Entrepreneurship Evolution and Growth Strategy

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Gaurav Aggarwal:

We just had a runway for six months. Quite a few times. We think you know I'm not happy here. Let me become an entrepreneur. I'll become rich quick. I had that never. Ever. Looking back in your life, you don't regret the decisions which you took and you messed up. What are the ones that you never took? Basically, I started Moonlighting, so I Moonlighted for good five years. So Indian travel market, which consists of air, hotel, of course, trains and intercity bus and intercity cabs around $55 billion.

Amit Somani:

Beyond, of course, profitability and growth, which is the mantra for this podcast. Customer money is way better than VC money. Welcome to the Prime Venture Partners podcast. I am delighted to have with me today Gaurav Agarwal, founder and CEO of Savari. Welcome to the show, gaurav.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

Thank you, amit, glad to be here.

Amit Somani:

Gaurav, I spent several years in the travel industry, you know, working at Make my Trip, and, from what I remember, transportation was a really tough business. And then, in particular, you know intercity transportation was even harder yet, whether it was buses or it was car rentals and so forth. So love for you. You know to tell our listeners and our viewers, you know how you thought about getting into this business in the first place, and maybe just a little bit of your own personal journey as well, sure.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So basically this all started. So I went to the US in 98 and since 99, I had been traveling within the US. So every city that you go to in the US you know that there are four or five car rental companies that you can hire the car from and pretty much you know their character. Like, hertz is more expensive, more corporate focused, and Dollar has always had deals and I used to book from them, so it's more retail-oriented. So in 2004, I wanted to come back to India and there was a travel that I wanted to, which was Intercity, which was from Delhi to Roorkee, and that's where I thought, you know, usually what I'd been doing there is that I'll book a car rental, chauffeur-driven car rental, which will take me from Delhi to Roorkee.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

And I wanted to do that online but to my surprise I could not find any cab rental company that I could book from. Of course there were some companies you know franchises of these European US companies that were there but, they were way too expensive.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

More corporate focus, and that's where the whole thought of. You know that we need a car rental company, that you as a customer can go to Any city in India and you know that you're getting a quality, reliable service at very competitive rates. So pretty much like buying a cool bit. So that's how the idea originated. And then, I think soon after, within a year, I was able to find some travel person who was able to provide me the ground support, and then I put up a website and that's how Savari started. This is way back in 2006.

Amit Somani:

And, very interestingly, you were at Intel, I think.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

No, I was in Cisco.

Amit Somani:

You were in Cisco, sorry, so like that was, like a must have been a stark change to even imagine going from a tech company like a Cisco to starting up a car rental company. Like, how did that transition happen in your mind and not just for you, I'm assuming, for your family, for your other colleagues saying, hey, what the heck is God of doing?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So I took a long time to do that.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So basically, I started moonlighting, so I moonlighted for good five years while I was working full time for Savari and, of course, in a little did I realize that I started initially putting one or two hours every day. You know, the website was up and we started getting our orders soon after that. So little did I realize that those one or two hours have got changed to four or five hours that I'm working over the years. And in the third year we were completely profitable, at least with the lean team. I was not drawing any salary, but at least we were able to manage our operations.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So that's how sort of you know, in 2009,. 10 is when I started seriously considering that I need to move back to India, which I always wanted to do that and, given the traction that I was seeing in Savari and the fund that I was having doing Savari, I thought, you know, it's a good time that I should move back. And then I did a trip prior to that where I met quite a few VCs like yourself, and then I got a very good vibe and got a fairly good positive response from them. So that bolstered my decision that this is the right time. And that's how it happened. Of course, my family is I mean, none of my. In my family there were no entrepreneurs per se. So my father worked for ONGC for good 35 years.

Amit Somani:

Hey, my dad too, Really yeah.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So he started his job there and retired from it. So he was sort of not very keen on that. But his only condition was that you know, at least one of you my wife and I should have a stable job. So my wife got a transfer from Cisco US to Cisco India and that's how that problem got solved. So that's how the change happened. And of course it was in Savari also. We knew that it's not we are going to own cars, so we are not going to do the heavy lifting of worrying about the on-ground parts that will leave to the vendors, but we'll provide a platform. So it was always a tech aspect in it. Of course the usage and the implementation was different. I mean Cisco. Of course I was doing, I was coding in C. I was a software developer there for good 10 years Coding in C, doing some really cutting edge technology and some great folks that were there. That's the most difference, but understood. But at least the tech part was common.

Amit Somani:

Yeah. So let me ask you this let's say there's somebody sitting in the US right now, in Silicon Valley or elsewhere, for that matter, in Seattle or Austin thinking about all this crazy stuff happening in India on entrepreneurship and companies are getting funded, and you know there's ebbs and flows but you know largely it's very bullish. Just saw a tweet from Paul Graham today. Somebody asked Paul Graham, the you know Y Combinator founder, some Indian founder asked him in a new cohort saying hey, should I incorporate in the US or India, and should I live in the US, in the Bay Area, or India? And he said you must absolutely live in India. The startups ecosystem is happening. Having made that transition yourself, what advice would you give somebody circa 2024? If they're thinking of starting up in India? Any somebody based in the US wants to start up in India.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So I think you have to be in the place where you're starting. I mean, I'm assuming that your audience base is here.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

Yeah, let's say where your customers are. You have to be there, you have to live and breathe that. So sitting in the US I mean, of course, when I was moonlighting it's you're away from that. So you have to be inside India. You have to understand that, you have to use the services here. Then you realize the diver mentality. How was it so? You've experienced it first hand. So you have to be in the place where, where you're doing setting from a distance, I don't think you can run a car.

Amit Somani:

Of course no. But in terms I was saying, do you have any suggestions on how would they make the transition? They're willing to make the transition right. They may not be able to moonlight or may not want to moonlight for three, four, five years. So let's say you have an idea and you say like, let me go to India and get this going. It's going to be a pretty big culture shock. I also lived in the US for 14, 15 years before moving to India. It was a big reverse culture shock to work here professionally, right. So, in terms of getting started up in India, any tips or suggestions, or you have to sort of figure it out.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

No, I believe that. Okay, in my case, I always wanted to come back to India, so there was no culture shock in the sense that I was born and brought up here. So for me it was no different. Of course, you know, if I were to join a company, there's culture may be different than what I'm experiencing in the US, but for my, doing my own thing, I don't think there was a difference. So, and one advice that, or the solution that I would have, is that, you know, come with the mindset of not going back, otherwise it's. I mean, if you were to compare, you can't compare India's everything. India always had everything. Now, of course, with the VC, with the flourishing VC ecosystem, it's much more prevalent. So there's there's seven of. You have to decide what you want India's everything to offer.

Amit Somani:

Absolutely Burn the bridges or burn the boat, as the case may be. So let's switch gears into just the India travel market and, in particular, you know the area that you play in. Can you share with our listeners some insights about what's up in the intercity transportation market, and not just the cab rental? Perhaps I'm sure you compare yourselves to an alternative of somebody taking a, you know Shatabdi or a one day Bharat, or you know taking a bus or something like that. So just some broad stats on how Indian consumers are moving across intercity in, at least in the areas that you would like to play in.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So so, just for for just you know, I'll start with the travel market. So Indian travel market, which consists of air, hotel, of course, trains, and intercity bus and intercity cabs are around $55 billion. So of course, 20 plus is air, 10 plus is, say, hotels, and the, the, the rails, the intercity bus and the intercity cabs are all around $7 billion. So that's how big the market is and of course, the travel is happening, especially after COVID. So I think probably last year was one of the best years that we have had for travel. So there's a lot of growth happening and people are traveling. We can get a visa happening in a in a big way.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So the opportunity is certainly there and of course, given that one shift that we've seen as per COVID is earlier that our business, if you were to look at while it was always focused on intercity.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

But they're too past to intercity. One is a round trip thing where you know keep the car and driver with you. The other is the one where you know just take a, you move from one city to another city, so one way drop, one way drop. So a lot of the one way intercity drops have started happening, especially after, after COVID happened, and that's what we also started focusing on, and currently it contributes almost as 40% of a wow of our, of our revenue. So it's it's doing well, and that's where the comparison comes directly with the intercity bus, with the, with the, with the rails that you have. So our prices are so competitive that if you're a party of two or three, then probably an intercity drop I mean as compared to see even rails or even bus will be economically cheaper too. And of course it it gives you the advantage that you are picked up from your door and you dropped at the door. So so that's where sort of you know, at least we are finding that there's a great opportunity there.

Amit Somani:

So I'm very surprised to hear that stat of 40% one way drops. Why is that? Is that? Is that still like short haul? Is it convenience? Short haul meaning like two 300 kilometers as opposed to 500, 700, 800 kilometers? What is the trigger point from the customer's point of view to do this beyond comfort, of course?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So comfort is certainly there. 200, 300 kilometer is the sweet spot. So maybe 200 to 400 is the sweet spot. And of course, you know we have the biggest route, which is Mumbai, pune, which is around 150 kilometer, even Bangalore, mysore for that. So I think that's a sweetest spot.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So one is, you know, even when you're going to a, to a court, for example, you're staying in a resort. So all you want is, you know, first day just drop me there and third day pick me up, so the results also become a full-fledged thing where you're probably spending the entire time. So those are some of the things that are leading it. And, of course, business travel has always been there. I mean, you can actually take a drop from Bangalore to Mysore, then come back when your work is done. So these are the basic indicators and, of course, during COVID, road travel is really happening, so that's where people want to explore more. The highways are sort of being built at a very fast pace, so all that is leading to a lot of people traveling in general Makes sense, any any surprising stats with respect to, like you said, mumbai Pune was the.

Amit Somani:

In fact I remember Bhavish of Ola started in Mumbai Pune before he pivoted Ola to a intracity market and intracity. You know cab service and all that and I think Mumbai Lona well, I'm not mistaken were some of the early routes that he was experimenting with, but any, like other popular sectors, preferred cars. You know surprising itineraries that you have seen or use cases that that people are using Savari for.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So so one is dear. Obviously, you know COVID was a very different time. So in COVID we have seen people traveling all the way from Bangalore to Kolkata, so leave alone the distance part, so they were moving all the way from there or Bangalore to say, say, bhuvaneshwar or Hyderabad to Mumbai, chennai to Mumbai, so all these long routes that we have seen. But we see that you know there's a lot of travel happening to even off beaten places like Mungi in Mumbai. To Mungi, where you know, which is an alternate for Lona.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

then you have these, you know, places like go Karnar, where a lot of people and some of these places can only be explored through road travel, so that's where sort of we are seeing.

Amit Somani:

And how about like preference of car or, like you know, like size of your party? Like you're saying, two to three makes it economical. Is it just families? Is it individuals? Is there any kind of emerging pattern there?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So it's a mix of both. Most of the leisure things will be with family or with friends. And as far as our status concern alone, 60% percent is a sedan. The remaining 65, around 65%, is a sedan, and then which is a four seater, then you have a six seater which is around 3035. Odd percentage and then remaining is very minor. So these are the two broad categories, not even hatchback. So sedan is the most preferred one because it's a longer travel. People want that space.

Amit Somani:

So sedan is like a swift desire, or something like that. Yes, so there's ethios ethios, and then, of course, on the longer one will be like an Innova. I've been a Savari customer for a few rides I've got a certainly remember an Innova, and then of course, maybe a desire or a or an ethios, I'm not sure. So those are the most.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

Those are the more popular. Now it's. Of course, innova is not there, so Christa's are there, which are very expensive. So there's another category of SUVs which is like a multi-artiga, so those are also coming.

Amit Somani:

Understood. I know, gaurav, you mentioned that you are asset light, right? None of these are your own cars, none of these are your own drivers. They're empaneled by you, of course, and their partners with you. So I have to go to the like.

Amit Somani:

What is the operational complexity of delivering a high quality service? Right? Because the driver may say, look, I'm not going to drop you here, or this is not included, or I want to add something. So every time, even the first few times I had rented on Savari, I was like very anxious that the person might say I'll drop you in Yelahanka, but you know I'm not going to come to Whitefield and I'm like dude with my baggage and all that. I can't like make another switch Now. In theory, it's promised, but when you started in 2006 or maybe in 2010, when you moved full time, how did you evolve it so that the driver and the quality of service could evolve to give a good experience to the customer, given that you don't own the car, you don't own the driver, you're really just a partner to them and you're probably taking a reasonable take rate also from them.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So I think, of course, if, in our, from day one, we knew that we have to provide a reliable, quality service and that, too, at very, very competitive rates. So that was very, very clear in our mind. So we have worked around this problem and it takes a long time to actually fix this. But, for example, it starts with what kind of partners you're onboarding. So there has to be a very good check in ensuring that these are the guys who have been probably you know more in the business, own a few cars, or at least one or two cars, and have been running their business well. So that is very, very important. So it starts with, you know, ensuring that the partners that you're onboarding have a certain quality.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

And then the second thing that we have relied from day one is, you know, for me, our car could be clean. For you car may not be clean. So that's where we have gone with the perception that the customer got after having traveled with us, which is, you know, captured in a very simple feedback is CSN, you like the car or you didn't like the car? Was the car clean or not? So that has been built into a great way in as a feedback to our partners to a platform that you know, whether we need to sort of retrain him, whether we need to encourage him, giving some incentives, or whether we need to block him.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So that is the second aspect that we have managed very well and of course it's it's course correction that are happening. You are fine tuning. The third, bigger aspect is communication. So we have people you know, therefore very important guys that are involved in our ensuring a great service. So one is our ops team, second is our vendor partners, third is our driver and fourth is a customer. And of course, you know, over longer trips it becomes even more difficult. So all we have to ensure is that at any point of time, at any stage or event in that trip, all the four have to be on the same page. And that's what sort of has delivered us great sort of satisfaction scores.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

I mean our NPS is in the range of it's 60 plus is one of the highest that you would find in a very, very tough sort of very difficult market right To solve for, yeah, yeah.

Amit Somani:

So help me understand. What does it mean to be on the same page? Is it just communication? Is it alignment? Like the customer, the vendor, partner, the driver is setting the expectation of what is to be expected by the customer before, before they go before they go, before they get on and even at various stages.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So I can't tell you 10 terms and conditions that are there. You may not read it, so I'll break it into two. Maybe I'll give you two when you make the booking to when the driver detail are shared with you, and another two when the driver has come. So that's how we have divided and that I mean we are giving very relevant information at the relevant time. Of course, you have access to all the TNCs that you, of course. So that's what I mean by communication understood, understood.

Amit Somani:

How about maybe just a little bit more on Savari, and then we'll go back to the building of the company and the fundraising and all that? How about the unit economics and profitability and so forth? Right, because of course, your asset light. How do you think about that? You know, was it always unit economics profitable on day zero, or did it take some time to scale it, to make it unit economics profitable or overall profitable at a company level? Maybe talk to us a little bit about that.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So, from the start and given at least intercity as a business is always had very good unit economics. And of course we have, over the years, we have taken certain I mean we have done certain experiments, taken a chance at where we have. We have decided, you know, we'll not worry about unit economics but naturally our investors, as well as our team and founders, we are all aligned that. You know we are doing a dhanda for making money, so we have to be unit economics. So you need to, I mean our unit economics have to be positive.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So, for example, even now and we keep a very close eye on that, I mean it's our contribution margin as a percentage of a net revenue is around 60%. Even if I take off my acquisition cost, we are still at 40%. So the very first customer that comes gives us money. So so that's something that we close, I mean hold very close to our heart and the whole ideas that we are providing in a value to the customer, that they should be fine and willing to pay us that money, and of course the value is provided to the driver also so that he is interested in working with us. So it's been there and somehow we have never been very aligned, that you know. Let's let it go all together. Short term, yeah, it makes sense, but then we have to ensure that the value is getting the money Understood.

Amit Somani:

Let's switch gears a little bit on the fundraising journey. I know early on you said you got good reception from VCs and others. You raised in fact you're right of inventors now and Atheera inventors then and Atheera now right, he was one of the early investors of their firm was the investor? Talk to us a little bit about how that was. And then, obviously, the big thing that caught my attention when you're with your recent kind of large investment from make my trip, was the fact that you hadn't raised anything for 10 years. I was like, wow, okay, there are people like that, I know like a handful. But so talk to us about just the whole building of the company and the capital raise process, both early and then later on, when either you didn't want to or you couldn't raise.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So, of course, as I mentioned that, you know, sort of when I was moving back to India, I had made a trip and I met some of the VCs, so inventors, of course, now, Atheera was the first VC that I had met. So, of course, you know, when I moved back, I kept in touch and in fact, they became a corporate customers. So then, towards the end of that 2011, 2011, when I moved, they offered us a term sheet because they were fairly happy and they wanted to get into the segment. So, and by 2012, march is when we closed the first round, which is a series, and of course, in those times the amounts were much, much more modest, very modest. So here, sort of within the first 12 years, 12 months of raising that capital, I think we grew very well. Then we thought, you know, it makes sense to for us to raise series B and within three weeks of running this process, we could get a term sheet from Intel Capital. So that also round closed fairly quickly and of course, you know, we went on doing our business.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

And then something very big happened where Uber entered the Indian market and of course that changed things quite drastically. And then, of course, soon we saw that sort bank followed out 210 million round in one of the, in one of our competitions. So that's where, you know, in early 2015. So 2013 is when Uber entered and early 2015 is when we, when we needed to raise capital and we said, you know, let's, we'll raise our series C. But when we went to sort of VCs, I think in their mind they had two big players, very well funded players, and it was the market was completely written off. So, of course, one is that the mental pressure of, you know, not raising money. The second aspect, of course, the problems that come with that. For example, we just had a runway for six months, so so we had to make changes fast. So we had a team of around 200 people then.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So we sort of restructured and you know we had to let go of 100 folks, and then at that point we were doing both the intra city as well as intercity. Intra city, of course, the long term duration lent us like four or eight, but then we completely sort of started sharply focusing on intercity because it had great unit economics and we felt that you know, that's a market that that probably makes more sense for us. So that's how sort of we we sort of started looking at it. And then, of course, inventors has been a great support throughout. They gave us a bridge down in 2016.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

But you know, of course we worked hard we could. We saw enough traction. Unit economics was always great for intercity so we could actually stabilize thing. And by 2019, it became our first financial year that we became property. So that's how sort of we could, we were able to manage. And of course, some of the things that we learned was that you know you have to keep a very close eye on your net cash, so how much of net cash you have if you were to suppose shut tomorrow. So that, so much so that you know every month we used to report it in the board meeting till the till, of course, the acquisition happened.

Amit Somani:

Now, now everybody does it Thanks to 2021 and 22 more than 21.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So that's how so we stable and, of course, you know, just when we thought things were looking all well, the great thing happened. Go ahead.

Amit Somani:

Yes, of course. So very interesting things, unfortunately. But you know how. Talk a little bit about the comparative landscape, right? One is, of course, ability or inability to raise capital, because Uber is funded, ola is funded, I think. Taxi, for sure, was also much later acquisition by by Ola Right.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

It was right after they raised the short bank round Right.

Amit Somani:

They acquired right this thing.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

They couldn't raise the money.

Amit Somani:

Yeah. So how do you like? How was that playing in your mind in terms of the business strategy? Right One is, of course, fundraising that, okay, get to break even, get to profitable, because who knows whether you'll be able to raise or not. The second is did that have any bearing on the fact that, look, uber and all are both, and taxi for sure going hard at the intracity market? Therefore, I should abandon that, because it's going to be a brutal fight, and go stick to maybe a different core competence and really do that. Just, was there any bearing on the competitive landscape as you thought about continuing to build and run the business?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So so just for your information, when, when we raised our first round, everyone there, including our competition, they were just sort of looking at consolidating this car rental market and then, sort of you know, making money out of that. But then of course, uber phenomena was happening way there, way back in the US and these guys sort of you know, they switched gears. They said, you know, let's focus on the on demand thing. But as far as we were concerned, we were fairly thrilled and excited about the market and the opportunity and the value that we have provided, which is a simple plane. You know this is a great big market. This is largely unorganized and there's a value to be given to the customer. So right since day one, that has not changed and in fact it there was never a serious discussion. You know that should be also moved to it, because the wind is blowing that way and, thanks to our investors, both are in a state that they, they could, I mean they were fine and not getting too too, too swayed away.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So that's so. That's why we never actually sort of looked at changing the thing. Of course, you know, I'm not sure what would have happened had we also tried to do that because, as we know, one of the guys became successful, one of the competitor what the other competitor had to shut shop. But looking back now, when I look back, I think it was the right thing, because we are even today. We are as excited about the potential that this market has and the value that we can provide to the customer that we were in day one. So for us, yeah, we stayed the course. We had hard time we couldn't raise, because we see is, of course they are smart people so they can say very well with the time, but we stayed course and we stayed put on what we believed and till this day, we believe, and the fact that Make my Trip has made this investment in us because they also believe the same thing is a great proof and a great validation of our strategy that we stuck to our guns.

Amit Somani:

Fantastic Switching gears. Just a little bit talking about the VC angle for a moment and this is more for me as a benefit to the VC as opposed to not necessarily the entrepreneur, which is, you know, a lot of VCs who are very product tech driven, struggle with these operating, you know, operationally intensive businesses. What advice would you give people like me, particularly since I've got the mic right, in terms of how to evaluate these businesses right? What are operational problems that are more manageable, either through brute force or by hiring right people or processes, and what are the things that you would define? You would say, hey, watch out, right, if that is an issue, right. So how should we evaluate operationally intensive businesses?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So I would think that every even I mean ours is a very, very operational yes, operational intensive business, so much so that every day the car has to reach on time, right so? But you can always find parameters and metrics around it that can give you a great satisfaction. That I mean even in our case. What are the early indicators? Of course the car will not reach is the outcome that we need to deal with. But two hours before can I know, based on certain indication on the ground that you know it's not going to reach, and I better figure and alternate.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So, like in our business, we have parameterized a lot of things. So so, even when I, if I were to look at, I would look at, you know, for example, unit economics is a great metric, and even for me I mean how much money are you making? If suppose I were doing a more sort of, you know, leasing the cars on a monthly basis, I mean what money I'm making, because I recently I also saw a business plan where there was no talk of it, while they are sort of almost owning cabs.

Amit Somani:

So I think those are the basic things, that that at least the even, no matter what, how much operation intensive it is, you can always parameterize it and have enough metrics that gives you satisfaction to you know, to get a good logical sense that what is being talked about is actually playing out, and was that the DNA from day zero or obviously it would have evolved or you know, did that kind of happen much later when there was some heft and scale and initially it was a lot more on human intelligence and spreadsheet and you know call centers just figuring out, can I get a car or not?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

you know, has the car reached or not, kind of be honest, it started like that, but I think once we raised the CSA in winter, so of course brings a lot of experience and they did bring that culture that you know and we used to have meetings every month, so there was a lot of data that was being asked on.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So I think that helped us figure out that. You know there are three important aspects in our business and we should have enough parameters. And now we have dashboards which can help you go two or three layers deep. For all those, you know, growth is one, execution is other and basic unit, economics and financial is the third one. So we have enough dashboards, there are reports that are generated and then we have a culture that every first and third Saturday, I mean the core team will sit and each team will present their own numbers. So one is that it keeps us everyone on the toes, and the second is we get the benefit of, you know, someone else looking at it. I mean a different perspective coming to the team. So I think that's how we we manage our business. So most of the story is in the data and, of course, there can be a door. I mean data. You can have a lot of data but not drive any meaningful incident. So we try to make as much sense and as many actions as we can, I think, based on data.

Amit Somani:

Wonderful. How about you know this recent, you know equity investment from both make my trip and also they bought out, I think, most or all of your investors, right? How did you make that decision? It's like a pretty Big decision in some sense, right? I mean, I'm sure, a fortune, just one as well. But how do you? What was the mental model going through your mind in terms of taking that investment and giving them a Significant or a majority stake?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So basically, you know buns, of course VCs are in. I think exit is inevitable. So you have to find I mean, of course you owe them an exit, so that was one, and of course it's been 10 years that they have been, 10 plus years that they have been with us, so so exit was always there in the mind, at least from their purse, I mean from their perspective. So, and given that if I 23, we did really well, while of course the travel was still recovering, we grew 40% on a pre-pandemic number, so we were on our, we had some on a trajectory, yeah, on a some great momentum happening. And that's where some inbound interest happened From one of the prominent OTAs saying that they would want their interest, they offered a value and we thought, you know, it's better to just reach out to a larger set. And that's how we reached out to make my trip, and then so you know, we felt that they are as excited about this Opportunity as we are.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

They have also tried to take a crack at it through a marketplace model while we have been a company and they were great synergies. By the way, in the marketplace we are one of the suppliers we have a working relationship with make money, or for a long, long time. So that's why we knew people, we knew that they understand, they were sincere, they were serious about doing the synthetic as because for most of the OTAs, you know, air and hotel is where the attention is, or holidays, but cabs does not become as as important. But make my trip short that they were. They meant business. So that's how it happened and and we see that it's a great chapter in our life. So for the next three, five years we we have a great shot in making so very, a very, very big Intercity company and and all the team is very excited about.

Amit Somani:

No, fantastic. I, of course, I found memories I worked at make my trip from the pre IPO days and and and and and so forth. But one point that you said is very, very important and interesting and I'd like to iterate it, for a lot of the founders listening to this is you know, in MNA doesn't just happen like you call someone and say, okay, I'm looking to sell or I'm looking to buy, right, you need to have a relationship, you need to have worked with them before. You need to have seen and appreciated their culture. They need to have seen and appreciated you and your team and your culture.

Amit Somani:

So oftentimes founders are like no, but I'm only going to go IPO, there is no other option. Or I'm only going to like, run this for the next. You know, 20 years or 40 years, it still is very smart to cultivate Some relationship, some option, value, some network, etc. Cause you don't never know. In this case you didn't necessarily need it, but you chose to exercise that option, right? And? And a lot of founders feel like wait, like why are you telling me this? I don't want to sell. No, you don't want to sell, but who knows what you would want to do five years from now right.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So so I and there's an opportunity which makes sense, you should take it because we felt that, you know, with the backing of the group, yes, you stand a great shot and doing it, so yeah, absolutely Absolutely.

Amit Somani:

One last thing, on, on, on, on Savari, before we'll talk about your entrepreneurship kind of journey and how you evolved as an entrepreneur and a person, did you ever get tempted by some bells and whistles, because it's such a, whether it was the transportation on the inside? Forget the fundraising for a second or international market. I know this one very exciting Chinese company Forget the name which would basically take people you know, like consumers from China who want to travel to, let's say, singapore or India or Indonesia or South Africa, and they would give them a Chinese speaking driver In the destination market that they travel like. Given so many Indians are traveling abroad, like my, I know my parents would love to have a Indian speaking driver when they go to an alien country, right, because then they're like there's some comfort. You can ask the driver or any of these other bells and whistles. Did any of these like attract? How did you stay so focused? Or was it just, like you know, capital is a constraint. Stay focused.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

Stay focused? Maybe both, but I think no. So we are actually with us. You can make a decision that you want English speaking driver, hindi speaking driver, and and we'll add more regional languages. So I think it's a necessity because there's a requirement. Yeah, there's a customer need for that. So I mean a lot of people, at least when they go to Chennai and all they ask for a Hindi speaking driver, so that that feature we have. So, but you know, we launched it only when we felt that there was a need and that it's actually sort of Gatering to a requirement from the customer. So we do have those. I mean Chinese know what we are. Maybe one day we will.

Amit Somani:

No, not really. No, I wasn't even thinking Chinese, I was thinking Indians going abroad. Given that you understand travel transportation, you could travel, try up with a travel partner in South Africa or in Indonesia or wherever. But when an Indian lands there, you give them an option to have a Driver who speaks at least English, possibly Hindi or whatever else.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

But anyway no. So I think Certainly an expansion should be there once we have cracked the Indian market. So I think we are still Distance from there.

Amit Somani:

You're in a large enough market, so so, so that's that's, that's good. So now you know, maybe talk a little bit about just your journey as an entrepreneur, maybe some of the lessons learned for you in terms of the Gaurav circa 2010, circa 2015 or 2017 and circa 2024, what are things that you would advise yourself, or Gaurav of 2017 or Gaurav of 2010 that you could have done differently or should have done differently, or maybe you should have done the same?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

Yeah. So of course, in hindsight I would have wanted that. You know, maybe I would not have sort of moonlighted for five years. You know, once you have an idea, jump on it, I think. And you know there's no backup plan, so just go with it. And, of course, the things that we have done, some of the things we didn't control. But I think the 10 year journey, ideally, I would want to maybe squeeze it in five, six years and do that way.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

The other thing is, of course, you know, even when I started, like anyone else, when I moved back to India, my idea was also that you know, in five years I'll do an exit and then that's it. But it takes much longer. So anyone who's trying to start out now should be very well prepared that no matter how good Excel you have, excel plan you have, it always takes longer to build a product, maybe at least twice that you would have planned. It will cost you much more. And that's third thing is even the traction we take. So those are the learnings that you know, even when you think that you have everything in control, even now, launching a feature takes much longer than what you would think because there's so many components that involved. So yeah, I mean, should have done faster, have been a little more, maybe more aggressive, but that is in hindsight. I think going forward what we are doing is probably the right piece that we are going.

Amit Somani:

So let me push back a little bit on that right, given that you stayed so frugal, even if you know necessity was the mother of invention. There is always a stress that entrepreneurs have in terms of the growth rate, right. So of course you can grow at 10-15% or even sometimes even a flat year on year to remain, you know, kind of profitable or bootstrapped or not needing to get capital. But then you feel like, look, I want to grow much faster. If you grow much faster, you may end up getting into the burn and other kind of bad habits, but you're growing faster because you know the market is still there, right, even now you're saying, look, there's no dearth of market opportunity in India. So how do you trade off the need and desire for growth to compress your 10-year journey into a 5-year journey? Right, with the sort of losing sight of the profitability unit, economic, etc. Because there is definitely a trade-off right there.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

Which certainly is true. So in our case, I mean, it's not that we didn't try, we tried to raise but we couldn't. And we knew very well that. You know, this market probably is sort of mobility, is not in the favour of the day yeah, for quite some years now.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

But you know, in our case, for example, if we were to raise a large round tomorrow or maybe earlier, I think there's a lot of marketing that can be done without compromising on the unit. The fact is that we have a great product. How fast can you tell? I mean, can I stand on a rooftop, on every rooftop, and actually shout that, hey, tomorrow, when you want to rent, please use it? So I think, at least in our case, if we were to just employ that money in marketing and it's not that I have to discount it so that one trial and then lifetime value for five years, nothing like that I would still make money. But I can benefit immensely if I get an opportunity that there are so many more people that can know about Savali. So far, majority of our acquisitions happen through organic research. Someone searches and then they find us and then they become our customers.

Amit Somani:

And they find you mostly through SEO or content. So we do very well both content and SEO. So those have been our driving part.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So I'm saying yeah, but of course, in any case, if you have an option to raise money, I think one should, of course, till the time it's not coming with unrealistic expectations.

Amit Somani:

Understood. Great, as we get towards the kind of end of the podcast. Right, maybe a few rapid fire questions and then we'll kind of wrap up. So I know you shared some of this already, but you know one do and one don't for either current or aspiring founders. Right, maybe a new one than the one that you already shared? Like, just do it, nike slogan.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So just do it and, you know, be prepared for a longer haul. I mean, nothing comes easily, and that applies even to us. You know, things take their own time. So you have to be very patient and you have to be at it. And I think the fundamental thing is you have to be passionate about what you're solving so that you know, even today, every day I come, I look forward to coming, but there's always some problem solving to be done. So you have to be passionate about the problem and, of course, if you experience the problem firsthand, it's an amazing thing. And if the market is big, I think you're lucky. Now you have to just execute, and don't is you know, don't? I mean quite a few times, we think, you know, I'm not happy here. Let me become an entrepreneur, I'll become rich quick I that never, ever happens. And of course, in it's like, some of the people do get lucky. They may not have very rich companies, but they're rich entrepreneurs. But in it's like much like lottery, you know, you can get lucky there too, absolutely.

Amit Somani:

No, I, I, but generally, in general, it's very hard Couldn't agree with you more on both points In the overall kind of ecosystem, right, entrepreneurship or even other, you know, leadership, sports. Don't want to get into politics, but which leaders inspire you the most? Which entrepreneurs, leaders, business leaders, anybody that inspires you personally?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So I think, given that a large part of my time and day goes into Savari, so I think any entrepreneur and I have experienced this firsthand any entrepreneur which is able to actually generate great growth I mean good growth with profitability, is someone that I would really really admire. I think that's something which, to strike the balance is a great, great thing, and I know personally, you know, even companies which are not VC funded and even VC funded were doing that.

Amit Somani:

So great admiration for such companies, so that will be something that that I really, I really admire, and I would think, savari also for all, since oh, for sure, For sure, no, no, I mean I think you are now one of the handful of poster boys right for having both grown and survived through through so many challenges, right, and?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

interestingly, all our survival, both times when we couldn't raise CDC and even in COVID is you know happened through customer money, because we were providing them a value, that we could depend on their money and we could thrive.

Amit Somani:

Yeah, I always tell founders that you know customer money is way better than VC money. Any, any day of the week and twice on Sunday, yeah, any, any. You know content that you consumed or have consumed, whether it is a book, article, podcast, anything that that you're an avid listener to that you would advise for other entrepreneurs.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So that's the I live. So that's kind of a tough one. So I don't. It's difficult for me to actually no, no, no worries.

Amit Somani:

Or maybe, maybe let me twist it Any learning that you, you know, received from someone right saying some X, it doesn't have to attribute to anyone. We can keep it to Chatham House rules, right, like this one thing you learned from somebody that really made a big difference in how you build Savari or how you grew yourself as a professional, some piece of advice, anything of that nature that comes to mind.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So, so generally, I would just quote from my notes. So there's a sitcom called phaser.

Amit Somani:

Okay, my favorite ones for Frasier? Yes, of course.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

Yeah, yeah. So in this the father of the central character phaser sort of, because he's giving him relationship advice. But I think it applies to entrepreneurs to was that you know, when looking back in your life you don't regret the decisions which you took and you messed up, made a fool of yourself, but the ones that you never took, so. So I think that applies very aptly. So so that is something that I, when we keep trying whenever there's an opportunity in Savari and I think for a broader entrepreneur ecosystem, that applies very well.

Amit Somani:

If you could shadow any entrepreneur for a day or have dinner with them or whatever like a private dinner, who would that be and why?

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So, as I mentioned, any guy who's doing growing well and, I guess, is profitable, I think there will be a lot to learn from them.

Amit Somani:

Okay, if you had to start up all over again for a moment, in a different industry from what you see let's stick to India for a moment which industry would you pick up? Which sector? Anything that inspires you right now saying man, there is a lot of unsolved problems there. If you were starting up in 2024, that may be an area to consider.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

So, interestingly, you know, I've done a business which is heavy on ops. So my next business or next industry has to be non ops, absolutely so that I can get both sides, and ops is different. So you know, something like maybe Google of 2000 or in a public city of today, something like that I'll be interested in, which can challenge me academically a little more than just pure ops. So so that's what it will be. If I get to it, which I don't see, I'll get to doing something.

Amit Somani:

Got it. God of this has been fantastic. Any closing thoughts or comments? Advice for people starting up or people running their companies, beyond, of course, profitability and growth, which is the mantra for this podcast.

Gaurav Aggarwal:

I think, enjoy what you're doing, don't worry too much. I mean, there's always peer pressure. Maybe your guy who's working in Google is earning more than you. But I think, do your thing and be at peace with it. If you're not at peace with it, you better do something else beyond that.

Amit Somani:

Absolutely, Satya Vachan. That is the truth. Thank you so much, Gaurav. Thanks for being on the Prime Venture Partners podcast. It was a delight to have you.

Prime Venture Partners:

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